Of course you are free to voice your disagreement but you can't really tell people to stop voting or to stop talking about a suggestion. I mean, you can, but you get what I mean. If admins decide that a suggestion is unnecessary to implement they will close it. In the meantime people are free to vote and talk about it.
I agree that the users should be publicly aware of the suggestions that won't be implemented ever and those that are in the works. Otherwise this is just a waste of votes and time. If they said they won't implement this suggestion, I'm not sure why it's still open because already 25+ people voted for it.
Also Ceki, there are a lot of people against this suggestion, not just 25 or so. Some just don't reply in the forums. :p
No one said to stop suggesting it exactly, at least with how you implied, like they don't have the right. It's just A.) This is a pointless argument since it was already decided upon and B.) This is a duplicated suggestion. (Unless the others have been deleted since. Idk.) I thought duplicate threads were locked or deleted anyway. With those in mind, I don't think asking people to please stop making this suggestion is wrong.
mediaklan:That's the issue : you can't know how many people are against it unless ... we were to create a voting topic against this suggestion. An idea which is already boring me to no-end.
Actually, it makes sense. Rince, repeat : If you decided to drop it at episode 2, then 'something' important to you wasn't there to push you further on the drama.
I would even say it's a dramatic drama epic fail ^^
Usually, there's more invested in the very first episodes of a drama (the first episodes are always trying to catch the viewers attention), so if it fails there ... ouch. Thus : a dropped drama usually means a very bad rating is closing in.
I'm not saying you can't drop it because you can, I'm just saying it shouldn't influence the final rating when you barely started the drama. If the drama sucked from the first episode, you can talk about it in the comments or just move on with your life.
The thing is, I'm not supportive of "YOU HAVE TO WATCH IT ALL" because like you said, the result can be pretty obvious from the beginning but I'm also not supportive "It sucked from the beginning therefore, the drama suck overall".
There should be a middle ground.
Like already said I think opening the vote only when the show ended will improve the real statistic of the show cause it will discourage people who vote for the hype, or for the favorite/not favorite actor. Cause after three months they will probably forget about that drama if they didn't watch it till the end.
I also don't think you should vote if you dropped. For that we have the comment section.
I was thinking about the idea to have a separate rating between completed and dropped. Then add a statistic who merge or make a comparison between them. It could be useful. But then we will have more problems. Users who drop can vote before while who watched till the end have to wait, this is not good for anyone. And we also can't force who drop to wait till the end cause like I said maybe they will forget to vote later on.
I think the vote theme is more delicate to handle from review.
For now I confirm my opinion to close down the rating while the show is airing. at least you could make a poll and maybe do a trial period.
Dramaknits:Maybe, instead of removing the ability to rate a drama you have not completed, you could add more information in the statistics. At this moment we can see the overall percentages of people watching the drama and the scores they gave. It could be interesting to see the average rating of people who dropped it and people who completed a certain drama. Or if they dropped it, how many episodes they watched and what scores they gave?
I suggested something like this last time this type of discussion took off. It would solve a lot of things if we could just see the average scores from the different populations. That way, anyone who doesn't want ratings from people who didn't complete the drama could just look at the rating from members who completed it. Done. (Well, one extra click to get to the stats page, but still pretty easy.)
hmm ... I still don't understand why a dropped drama shouldn't influence the final rating. Dropping a drama is already a final rating. If you were to drop a drama, I would like to take your valuable opinion into account (your rating included), because - again - dropping a drama is no small feat.
Besides, while score/rates can help there, as RoseRain said it's not the only tool in MDL to know more about a drama before actually watching it. So maybe your rating will not be final to me, but at least it's the user freedom to take the information it provides ... or not.
One of the reason I don't support this suggestion is that it aims to remove such informations, even if it aims to remove only "misleading" ones.
Anyway, I can see everyone thinking about a solution (for an issue I don't get, but still...) so here's mine, which is a mix between several I've read here :
A filter menu, just before the review section for example (or integrated on the top of it), that would only keep up the reviews and ratings from the users that actually completed the drama (or anything else that suits your needs). It could even update the overall score/rating solely based on this filter (a little harder to do, but not that much).
mediaklan:hop, for the fun of it :
This pic would work here instead: https://mydramalist.com/discussions/suggestions/31400-block-reviews-until-fully-watched?page=2&r=notif&_nid=430985#p762249
Dropped drama influence the final rating too much. How can you make an overall judgment if you watched only 3 episodes? It end up like that: I didnt like that actor, dropped and vote 2. But maybe, if I can overcome that actor and watch till the end, I find out the drama was overall well written and I would have vote 6.
But the idea of closing down the rating is more for users who vote before the drama-movie start air. For the dropped problem I'm also favorable to add more statistic so we can split the rating between completed and dropped.
I think the episode guide section is very useful and could resolve a lot of problem if we encourage users to use that instead of spamming the details page. And I'm the first one to do that. I know :(
It's not possible to insert the episode guide into the details page comment section? I mean create a drop-down menu where clicking on it, the episode guide expands, people can comment and vote on the single episode.
And how can you make an overall judgement about dramas alltogether if you've watched only 3 of them ? Is it better when you've watched 10 of them ? 100 ? 1000 ?
As I already said earlier, every minute, every scene, of every episode, could get a rating. So yes, watching 3 episodes is perfectly enough to make a judgement.
One minute of episode is perfectly enough.
Of course, a judgement from 1 minute of a drama may sound silly to the viewers with more 'drama experience' but 'drama experience' is not a requirement to make a judgement.
Of anything.
Besides, dropped drama influence the final rating the same as a 10 score rating influence it because "oh-my-god-this-is-the-best-drama-i-have-ever-seen-in-my-life". But in the case of the dropped dramas, the reason (in your example, disliking the actor) why the user dropped is less important than the act (to drop the drama) itself. The user can still argue "I didn't like the actor", in the end the drama in its whole wasn't enough to retain the user attention. There's nothing to overcome anymore once you drop.
And for me, that's an argument valid enough (at least an argument I can understand even if I could disagree) for the bad rating that follows.
In the end, as a MDL user I will just follow what the admins will do, whatever they decide to do and stop argue here anyway. I still need to thank you all for your arguments, because even if I can't agree to all arguments for the suggestion, at least I for myself can now better understand some of your expectations.
I am confused by the screencap? What does it have to do with the debate at all? From what I can see, silent_whispers didn't drop the drama. She just mentioned she liked the first half. Never did it say she dropped it after that and wrote the review. :/ Unless you are making the point she had formed an opinion early on.
I still agree with everything you said, mediaklan. It is to be expected people will form an opinion as soon as they start a drama and it isn't right nor fair to force them to surpress it just because they didn't watch the whole drama.
I really, really think the whole trend lately of trying to force people to manage their lists and experiences like others needs to stop. It's seriously becoming an issue with all these forceful suggestions and telling people they are wrong to not rate/review/manage things like you want them to.
Argh, damned, I should have blurred out the reviews and users names in my mockup screen. This mockup screen is something I made : the idea was to show a solution (even though I don't agree with the suggestion at all : advocate of the devil inside !) based on a drop-down menu filter : from the menu you select only users whom have completed dramas, and it updates the reviews, ratings and overall score based on this filter. So the only thing to see in my mockup is the drop-down menu ... I didn't pay attention to the users, sorry (I will see to it).
EDIT : there you go, all better now. Refresh your browser or wipe cache.
No one talked about being a drama experts, I think you misunderstood my exemple, I was talking about numbers of episodes of a single drama. If you watch only 3 episode out of 16 you don't have enough information (acting, soundtrack, plot scrip) to express an objective vote.
It's like reading one chapter of a book instead of the entire book.... or watch 10 minutes out a 180 minutes movie.
It's like a teacher who read only one page out of your homework and give you a vote...... would you be cool about that?
My suggestion is that Users who drop can vote each episode in the episode guide but the main page rating is for the entire drama (completed).
Poia, let me take - again - your examples :
- If you've finished reading one chapter of an entire book, you have already form an opinion from this one chapter.
- If you watched 10 min of a 180 min movie, you've already form a judgement from these 10 min.
- And while this teacher is a jerk ^^, he has already form an opinion from the one page he has read.
Whether this judgement is accurate/silly/thruthful/stubborn/fair (etc) is not even that important. Judgements all comes down from your own personal experience as a human, and I absolutely don't care if you're a drama expert or not. I would still gladly know why you dropped a drama, why you gave up a bad/good rating, and I prefer that it shows up in the reviews and rating section because it's your valuable opinion.
etc etc etc
Oh ok! I see what you mean, mediakin! Cool. (^_^) Thank you for explaining.
Poia, I am personally cool with however anyone chooses to rate what they watch or drop. It is not up to me to tell anyone they haven't watched enough to form a valid opinion. It is up to the person to decide what their own opinion on the matter is. How would you like it if I told you that you absolutely had to rate every drama you have ever watched, incuding dropped dramas? You would not like it at all, would you? It is the same thing. You want to tell everyone else when and how they can rate what they watch. Us people disagreeing with you are doing so, not to start drama or anything, but because we feel it is not right to insist upon something like that. See what I mean?