My suggestion is:
- Not allowing any user to mark a show as "Completed" until the last episode's airing date. Or on the new version, change the states to Ended/released.
- Not allowing any user to review a show without marking the show as "Completed".
- Add "Drop Reviews" for people who want to write a review about the reason they dropped the show. However, they should watch 20% of the show.
It is against the rules to actually write a review before watching all of the episodes. So, I'm suggesting this because the last thread was locked by the admin due to it suggesting that we blocking the ratings too (which I'm against and believe the admin is too since he closed the suggestion).
Edit: The thread was closed by the admin due to users deviating for the suggestion I made and talk about other things. It is a shame since people will not be able to discuss or vote for my suggestion now.
I'd also like to add:
- Not allowing any user to write a review in a language other than English.
Seriously, I've noticed so MANY users reviewing ongoing dramas or films that haven't been even released yet!
There are also people who do not differentiate between a review and comment. A review is NOT a few sentences. That's a comment.
It's nonsensical. Something needs to be done about it.
I disagree because I believe anyone who has watched any amount of episodes should be free to share their opinion. The newer MDLers have sort of shifted the site to a more autocratic rather than a place where a democratic and "lassez faire" environment people can be exposed to all sorts of opinions.
Having said that, I value the review of someone based upon lots of factors including total number of dramas, type of dramas, etc. In this scenario, a easy solution would be for the website masters to write a script that automatically displays how many episodes the reviewer has watched upon writing review. This is simple and is automatically pulled from the writer's list.
Writer is thus able to write whenever he wants. be it a positive or negative review.
And reader is able to deduce whether he agrees or disagrees. and whether because of said review if they want to pick up the drama, continue the drama, or ditch the drama.
Note: I believe i have written zero reviews so you could say I have no personal investment in this proposal.
There are lots of good things about MAL but MAL is very limiting due to over-moderation which I fear has been a stance that MDL has started to take over the past few months compared to many years ago making it become a more detached website. For example, I have heard people complain of how difficult it is to write an article because of various criteria.
Note: I have never attempted to write an article so I also have no personal investment in that.
And for that reason i completely disagree that a few sentences do not make a review. On a similar note, just because a review is lengthy does not mean they are good. Some lengthy reviews are utter rubbish. Please do let the common people share their thoughts in a manner rather than a comment that is lost in the sea of 1000 comments that nobody will ever see again and give them the fair opportunity to be judged by the public.
In fact, there is already a working solution to decide which reviews are good or bad. I believe people can upvote or downvote or something to that extent an individual review. I believe also the best reviews are highest on the list. I believe a thing to complement that would be to be able to easily organize reviews by total number of votes, percentage, and date.
I want to see more articles, read more reviews good or bad but I can see how with all these changes people would be denied that opportunity to share.Overall, I'm just someone who want to keep the site involvement high and I am concerned this proposal would serve only to stunt that without any tangible benefit.
bannie:There are lots of good things about MAL but MAL is very limiting due to over-moderation which I fear has been a stance that MDL has started to take over the past few months compared to many years ago making it become a more detached website. For example, I have heard people complain of how difficult it is to write an article because of various criteria.
I don't think that MAL is very limiting. I seriously don't see any point in writing a review such as "weeee me likes this drama!!" or writing an article that is a complete mess. There are personal blogs for things like that. I would personally stop coming to a community such as this one if anyone could do, write and publish anything they want to.
Ceki:I don't think that MAL is very limiting. I seriously don't see any point in writing a review such as "weeee me likes this drama!!" or writing an article that is a complete mess. There are personal blogs for things like that. I would personally stop coming to a community such as this one if anyone could do, write and publish anything they want to.
I dont think it is yet. However the change proposed moves it in that direction in my humble opinion. Reviews such as the one you mentioned would not be visible after it is thumbed down or some real reviews are thumbed up. Another option to prevent abuse would be to remove reviews after it has a certain significant number of thumb down and baiscally classified as spam, like the one you suggested.
In fact, talking about spam. There is a lot of spam on the forums from fake account that irritates me more because those are truly spam and not someone who is happy about a drama but has written an "insufficient" review or written a review "too early".
I would prefer articles to also be based upon the same principle of thumb up or down. Even a poor article I am sure has its merits to the right audience. However, that ship has already sailed so thats probably not a discussion that would be useful to have any more. It truly isnt like there are lots of articles to start with. I for one am not bothred by the volume at this time but would prefer more volume in fact.
bannie:I disagree because I believe anyone who has watched any amount of episodes should be free to share their opinion. The newer MDLers have sort of shifted the site to a more autocratic rather than a place where a democratic and "lassez faire" environment people can be exposed to all sorts of opinions.
But it has always been a rule not to write a review before watching all of the episodes. It is even written on the review page. What we want is a system that just blocks it until the drama/show ends, instead of having to report it since it doesn't follow the rules. It is not about the shift influenced by users, the rule has always been this way since the start.
Hessa:But it has always been a rule not to write a review before watching all of the episodes. It is even written on the review page. What we want is a system that just blocks it until the drama/show ends, instead of having to report it since it doesn't follow the rules. It is not about the shift influenced by users, the rule has always been this way since the start.
I wasnt aware of that! Perhaps then I would like to suggest a change to that rule for the above reasons. Although I do agree that it with that new information it is definitely a very appropriate suggestion and easy to implement.
However, does the momentary disorganization from a really bad review until it is usurped by a decent review really bother us so much? In fact, I actually find that i can be useful to read reviews by people who have dropped the drama. Those usually list reasons as to why they disliked it enough to drop it and give me information to consider if I should take up the drama.
I do agree with Ceki in that I am a little OCD myself and delete my own threads in Support or Suggestions once I have the answer or see a more populous thread with the same idea because I do like things organized.
bannie:In fact, I actually find that i can be useful to read reviews by people who have dropped the drama. Those usually list reasons as to why they disliked it enough to drop it and give me information to consider if I should take up the drama.
That is why I suggested "drop review" as I have written above. I do like reading them too, but they need their own place so that people who don't want to read them can filter them out.
bannie:Another option to prevent abuse would be to remove reviews after it has a certain significant number of thumb down and baiscally classified as spam, like the one you suggested.
That is a good idea. And I have nothing against people reviewing dramas that they dropped but writing gibberish and posting it as a review is crazy tbh. Especially because we can write anything in the comment section as long as it is not offensive, so I really don't get the need to pass two sentences as a review. It's even worse if they're not in English, it reminds me of Viki.
I think review should be written using an objective judgment. And I think it works like that all around the world and in every sector (books, movie, art...) I also think you can't have an objective opinion if you don't watch, read .... till the end! So it's implied that if you drop something you can not make a review, but you have to limit yourself to comment. Cause you don't have all the knowledge to make a correct review.
I vote too for close down review and open only when the drama-movie ended. If that is a problem I can accept the idea to hide the review like the admin suggest.
I vote to make impossible to make a review of something listed as dropped or at least separate review from someone who drop and someone who completed. But I think it will be a waste of work (for the admin) cause users can say they completed even if it's not true. So I would be happy if at least we can resolve the problem of pre-air review.
I also vote to eliminated-hide review too short like comments. Put a minimum of characters.
This is not a limitation of freedom, but common sense, some users need to learn a few stuff about how be impartial and objective when the time to vote and review arrives. For all the other stuff we have comment section and feed activity. Users can express their subjective freedom there.
I was all for this suggestion until I read Bannie's very well thought out and very significant reply and reasoning. Unfortunately, I don't see how I can take my votes back now. :p I am completely and all for the locking of allowing reviews for dramas and movies not yet aired, but now, my opinion is swayed when it comes to those who drop one or those still airing. The logical result, anyway, will be that people need only to mark it as completed and write what they want anyway. It would open up way more abuse of the feature with that in mind.
As to the quality of reviews. I do understand what you mean and how it is annoying to see reviews you think are badly written, but it really isn't right or fair to censor people based on how you feel about a person's writing ability. Many people do not speak English very well here. Maybe some of those one or two sentence reviews are the best way they can express how much they enjoyed a drama in a language that is not their own. Maybe they are not a very wordy or articulate person. It really doesn't matter. Those people, as long as they are not bots or spammers, are just as entitled to express themselves and their opinions as the rest of us. If you find the review is unhelpful, don't mark it as helpful. If you see it goes against rules already in place, then report it. Otherwise, simply hit the back button and ignore it. It really does not hinder yours or anyone else's experience on MDL at all.
This next part has nothing to do with the topic and is in response to one of Bannie's posts above. Still, I find it *extremely important* and have wanted to discuss this topic for a long time so I am very, very thankful to Bannie for bringing it up first because I have had absolutely no clue how to but it needs to be discussed. If this needs to be moved to a different thread because it is irrevelent to the main suggestion, please do so but I do ask it not be deleted and that the subject is allowed to be raised and discussed.
Bannie has also raised a different very important issue that I have also noticed going on here on MDL for a while now. That of trying to impose heavier modding and enforcing of various policies, ultimately limiting users' personal management and use of the site and features. I am not trying to derail this thread at all, and am commenting on it here only because someone else brought up the subject. It is extremely concerning to me and, I would assume, many other users. There are many suggestions and requests that are, legitimately, made to to enhance everyone's safety and enjoyment of the site. Yet there have been a TON of proposed suggestions aimed at controlling and limiting people simply because people doing things differently annoys or bothers others. I don't think that is fair. I am not saying to limit people from giving their opinions or suggestions, but I do think maybe suggesting a series of guidelines for making suggestions might be helpful for everyone. Such as, before making a proposed suggestion, does the suggestion benefit everyone or is it more of a personal prefrence? If the suggestion is implemented, will it interfere with how others choose to manage their personal list or express themselves? Things like that. Not rules exactly, but things to consider before making a suggestion. I think it could be extremely helpful for our community.
Also, I keep seeing MAL being used as an example. 'Well MAL does it this way.' Or, 'MDL should be like MAL.' I'm sorry, but last time I checked, MDL was seperate from MAL and is a completely different site and a completely different community. I don't use MAL so I personally don't have any idea what it is like but I do know that if I were interested in MAL, I would join the community there. I am a member of MDL and I don't care about what they do over at MAL. I only care about what goes on here.
Finally. This is a very important one. There seems to be no forum where people can post about what Bannie and I have brought up. In fact, I am already anticipating being asked to delete this, since it is not exactly directly about the actual suggestion. Yet, if I were to have made a seperate thread in Suggestions for this, I would have been told it was pointless and to delete it, as I have been in the past when I tried to bring up a concern about a policy. The only option people have is to directly PM Skye and Ji-N, which is awesome for some issues, but not so useful if you want to open up a discussion about stuff.
I don't understeand all this problem about limited freedom.
I'm only talking about reviews. Like I already said it's common sense:
1.review and comments are two very different stuff. I think some of us didn't realize that. So it's just right to have seriously rules about on how to make a review. It's not to limit anyone freedom or to favorite some users, it's about to improve the basic function of MLD as database. votes and reviews should be realistic, objective and well written, so users can have a real idea about a drama-movie to decide if watch it or not.
2. I really would like to write review and articles, I don't do that cause English is not my primary language and I know I would not make a good work. Like I said it's basic commons sense, if I can think that, I expect that other users have the same courtesy. I totally don't excuse people who makes a two review sentence cause they don't know the language, there is a comment section for that. If you are not good enough in English don't make review in English, is simple! there is a reason if in most of the website the articles-review staff need to pass a selection, bringing some article and prove grammar skills, to became part of the staff.
I'm not saying that only staff should write review, but we need some basic rules and make users respect them.
I agree to let users make review in their own language, if I see a review in Spanish (for exemple) I will just scroll down, don't see any problem in that. Actually suggest to force people to use only English, that is a limitation of freedom.
I really hope we could go back on track of the topic, the basic problem are two:
- users who makes review before the airing date or after a few episodes aired.
- users who confuse a review with a comment.